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Thread: barbarian speed buff needs revamp

  1. #1

    Default barbarian speed buff needs revamp

    any of you think that it is too op that barbarians can run in at super speeds, dish damage and run out without being killed.
    I can kb a barbarian but unless I can kill a barbarian in one kb, the barbarian will get away before I can do anything.
    Also, why is it that in minigames my barbarian (along with everyone else's barbarian) will get speed buff even when no magic hits them (like when capture the skull just first starts in the first 2 sec) other times at random moments.

    arcane marauder needs a fix, period.
    Too easy, think your good? Try a reaver stance barb.

  2. #2

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    Quote Originally Posted by throughthedoor View Post
    any of you think that it is too op that barbarians can run in at super speeds, dish damage and run out without being killed.
    I can kb a barbarian but unless I can kill a barbarian in one kb, the barbarian will get away before I can do anything.
    Also, why is it that in minigames my barbarian (along with everyone else's barbarian) will get speed buff even when no magic hits them (like when capture the skull just first starts in the first 2 sec) other times at random moments.

    arcane marauder needs a fix, period.
    Barbarian speed is the only good thing the class has going for it in PvP. Fix the utterly pathetic damage/survivability ratio then we can talk about AM.

    As for AM proccing without damage, it also procs on crits by healing spells cast on the barb. If your healer starts the mini with a HoT and gets a crit on it you'll have AM at the start of the fight. Goes to show how deeply you know the class...

  3. #3

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MagnusLL View Post
    Barbarian speed is the only good thing the class has going for it in PvP. Fix the utterly pathetic damage/survivability ratio then we can talk about AM.

    As for AM proccing without damage, it also procs on crits by healing spells cast on the barb. If your healer starts the mini with a HoT and gets a crit on it you'll have AM at the start of the fight. Goes to show how deeply you know the class...
    Also shows how messed up Arcane marauder is. The whole thing of "we need this one or two OP stuff to keep competitive" argumentation has ruined the class balance from the start and keeps people from fixing things that are otherwise inbalanced and broken.

    Same with ranger traps and VoM: Sure, ranger and DT would be a lot less powerfull and annoying without it...but shouldn't this be a clue to fix things and start making these classes (and barb) fun and balanced to play without relying on that one or two class specific features??? There simply should NEVER be such a powergap in between chars of the same class and gear, just because they have a specific build, unless you spec total crap. But a dps, survival and hybrid build should always be valid to play (with pros and cons) and one specialization should never allow for max output in all the three areas (as with some ranger builds for example).

    In general concerning the whole bunch of speedbuffs, funcom needs to do some verification checks:
    - on what value does the buff base the +% modifier?
    - does it add speedbuff to animations?
    - how does it stack? (check point 1 here too)
    - does it do what the description says? (in case of arcane marauder)
    - from what resulting speed does our netcode and synchronizing suffer? e.g. how much speed can our engine handle?

    There are some that were fishy in the past for sure.
    Last edited by Kurt2013; 23rd October 2014 at 07:57.

  4. #4

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by throughthedoor View Post
    any of you think that it is too op that barbarians can run in at super speeds, dish damage and run out without being killed.
    I can kb a barbarian but unless I can kill a barbarian in one kb, the barbarian will get away before I can do anything.
    Also, why is it that in minigames my barbarian (along with everyone else's barbarian) will get speed buff even when no magic hits them (like when capture the skull just first starts in the first 2 sec) other times at random moments.

    arcane marauder needs a fix, period.
    Because popping all your Reaver Barbarian 1-shot feats with a macro and landing Upheavel and they don't die and escape...

    Reaver macro spec no easy.

    Then using Haste in exactly the same way <3
    Funcom's Latency Detonation crits you for 4800 millisecond damage. Claret died.

  5. #5

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Surgery View Post
    Because popping all your Reaver Barbarian 1-shot feats with a macro and landing Upheavel and they don't die and escape...

    Reaver macro spec no easy.

    Then using Haste in exactly the same way <3
    You forget popping anti cc to so nobody can interrupt

  6. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by viroku View Post
    You forget popping anti cc to so nobody can interrupt
    Sh!t Mah Bahd
    Funcom's Latency Detonation crits you for 4800 millisecond damage. Claret died.

  7. #7

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurt2013 View Post
    Also shows how messed up Arcane marauder is. The whole thing of "we need this one or two OP stuff to keep competitive" argumentation has ruined the class balance from the start and keeps people from fixing things that are otherwise inbalanced and broken.

    Same with ranger traps and VoM: Sure, ranger and DT would be a lot less powerfull and annoying without it...but shouldn't this be a clue to fix things and start making these classes (and barb) fun and balanced to play without relying on that one or two class specific features???
    I'm all for it, but it requires a total class revamp. To put it simply, the basic mechanic on which barbarian is supposed to work (the longer you fight the stronger you become due to Blood Rage/Reaver stacks) has been completely denied in PvP by the insane bursts granted by the T4 weapons which make the fights too short for the stacks to rise significantly. What's even worse, as time goes by and new tiers of gear (both PvE and PvP) are introduced into the game, the worse this situation gets. The Unchained minis would have reversed the trend by forcing everyone on lower tier gear, but they have been shelved.

    There's also another huge problem when it comes to barbarian revamp: *HOW*, exactly, do you want to revamp it? What's the specific purpose of the barbarian class in the general framework of the game? It's a squishie dps class, but it has lower single target dps than necros and sins and can't compare in AoE capabilities to necros, demos and ToSes. It can't heal, it can't tank... it has extremely limited group buffing ability and no special stuff like e.g. the conq battle rez. For PvP, the berserker has too little burst and the reaver too little survivability, not to mention that the niche for "class which runs in, bursts people down and runs out" is already taken by the sin.

    The first question to answer in designing a revamp would be "what specific function do I want the barbarian class to have that no other class can currently fulfill". As of now, at least as far as I know, no dev has bothered to even ask himself that question, much less try to come up with an answer, in the last four and a half years.

  8. #8

    Default

    I won't comment on the overall balance of barbs, but I will say playing lighter classes (for me Necro, Tos, Hox) barb speed buff and some associated abilities are pretty absurd. No doubt it is a well needed survival skill; I don't disagree there. But it seems to proc at anything, sometimes not even magic based attacks. For instance, Barb hits necro with runed flesh on, that hits barb with magic damage and it will proc even though the barb didn't even get hit by a real spell. This is compounded by some pretty insane instant damage skills and CC breaks/resists.

    Let me use this as an example: Yesterday I was playing my PVP 6 TOS in LT. Me and a PVP 6 (Not going to name who but he is id say average/above average skilled) barb found each other in a 1v1. He was able to run at me at one million miles per hour, the first white hit staggered me, ATG, Decap I think and fatalitied me from 45% within ~3-4 seconds of engagement. Here is a list of CC's that he resisted: Interrupt, snare from interrupt, Fangs, stun, and root. Afterwards he was able to escape my group at a faster rate of speed than any other class in the game. Being staggered from the start, having all CC's resisted, and being fatalied from 45% leads me to believe that literally no one in my position could have possibly won that engagement. No doubt balance is in the eyes of the user, but as a light armor user it is extremely frustrating being put in situations where there's literally nothing I can do as a player to win.

    *Disclaimer obviously this was just a specific engagement so I'm not saying EVERY engagement is like that etc.*
    Last edited by Usedtissue; 23rd October 2014 at 20:25.
    Usedtissue Necro 10//Emptycan ToS 7//Puggles HoX 6//Ammagaden Guard 5//Trollololo Conq 5//Bottlecap DT 2

    PM me to sign the Minigame buddy sign-up petition: (http://forums.ageofconan.com/showthr...40#post2135540)

  9. #9

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    It procs with crits from abilities and dots, even when it's physical damage. I can understand why some people find it annoying but I'd worry about fixing other things long before that (hello rangers).

    Barb is pretty outrageously strong atm though, the few tweaks + the new pvp gear = beast (same boat as the new hox). Hard to kill (decent mitigation, hp, regen + unstoppable when low hp), great burst if you play ATG/decap or even both (fags), virtually impossible to CC & best mobility in the game. My ATG is critting for 3k on clothies every day and devastation definitely works with it (doesn't feel like it works with upheaval though...). If I go upheaval it's harder to get kills but I'm much tougher, pretty damn insane self healing thanks to without warning.

    And I'm not talking about hybrid cos it hasn't really changed at all and it's still viable (but squishy and not as good to support the team).
    Expert Shield of the Risen opener.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by kalston View Post
    It procs with crits from abilities and dots, even when it's physical damage. I can understand why some people find it annoying but I'd worry about fixing other things long before that (hello rangers).

    Barb is pretty outrageously strong atm though, the few tweaks + the new pvp gear = beast (same boat as the new hox). Hard to kill (decent mitigation, hp, regen + unstoppable when low hp), great burst if you play ATG/decap or even both (fags), virtually impossible to CC & best mobility in the game. My ATG is critting for 3k on clothies every day and devastation definitely works with it (doesn't feel like it works with upheaval though...). If I go upheaval it's harder to get kills but I'm much tougher, pretty damn insane self healing thanks to without warning.

    And I'm not talking about hybrid cos it hasn't really changed at all and it's still viable (but squishy and not as good to support the team).
    Agreed. It is annoying, though there are MANY other things I would rather see fixed first.

    I still use my hybrid spec even after the changes. More fun and I still can burst things down faster than the noob mode Decap+ATG specs running around lately.

    I haven't used Decap for years and don't plan to. I don't even remember the last time I used ATG.
    Dorrak / 80 Barb - PvP 8
    Tartug / 80 DT - PvP 8

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