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Thread: Pvp festival issues

  1. #1

    Default Pvp festival issues

    I love pvp daily quest and weekly festival but there are some issues.
    As picture say more than words here it is:
    http://www.truimagz.com/host/viroku/...picture100.png

    Idk solution to this but its almost worse than bori.
    Last edited by Melcom; 18th October 2014 at 09:41. Reason: Edit link

  2. #2

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    Quote Originally Posted by viroku View Post
    I love pvp daily quest and weekly festival but there are some issues.
    As picture say more than words here it is:
    http://www.truimagz.com/host/viroku/...picture100.png

    Idk solution to this but its almost worse than bori.
    I have given solutions as suggestions already. As with Bori you just need to make fighting more attractive than not fighting. This means reDESIGNING a lot of the quests and reward participation more. Now that they have so much tools and items at hand, it should not be a problem.

    As it is, it is a fishy business...big guilds and powerful chars are rewarded and when the cannonfodder "tryout" people are gone, they will use this system to farm up and gear their alts. Also a lot of the quests are not thought through well or even work with certain populations or if the participants or grouped or guilded (thus the big guilds or certain insiders use alts again).

    Back to the design: There is a minimum and a maximum number to many of the festival quests of how many people and which classes profit from it. For determinating "winners" and their rewards, it might work under certain circumstances.

    Take arena (solo). The setup profiting most from it is a bunch of 2-4 people where no archetype is double. So only in this pop range everyone can fight, everyone can profit. Now assume you have 6 rogues, 1 soldier and 5 mages. Of course the soldier will win in any case, because the rogues and mages will fight amongst each other mostly...and only 3 chars benefit here AT ALL from the 13 total. More numbers do not help this ratio at all. (i am not counting in the regular pvp xp, because the amount you get with current population is diminished fast, especially when grouped. This is ridicolously small when you compare it to the quest rewards, even with "win" buff). This is not good and fair design, therefore i suggested participation rewards. Also the rewards should be linked to the challenge. Let people hold hands and not fight during a fields of slaughter for example (or just do the minimum kills). But do NOT give them the best rewards/risk ratio!!!

    Talking of fields of slaughter: If we do the same look at fields as who can profit, we have 6 people who can easily profit, especially if they are premade. It is also easy here to boost up guildies and friends, you just need the powerfull chars fighting off competition, while your friendly six lowbies hold the point. The "friendly" powerfull group can even kill off a few times the holding group to get the "kill players of flagholding team" done. Easy to do when you are a big guild, impossible for small guilds or randoms when such a dominating group is there. To add here, funcom made it impossible to avoid this by locking epic and making it without cooldown, so even if there were multiple instances or epic, the farm group/guild can easily switch and dominate the next instance....
    The solution here would be again a participation quest (with lesser pvp xp, but tokens). Also the kill quest here should be split, so to finish it, you do not have to have captured all points AND killed 25 holding flag or showed up AND killed 3 holding flag. That way the majority of players (all those not in the farm group) would have a chance to finish something and benefit from grouping, assaulting and fighting.

    Arena (group) also screams for participation rewards, since again, the group profiting here is 6 people maximum. And with more motivation and thus more players, chances are better to get roughly balanced fights or multiple groups of 6 people. Otherwise you might have a huge crowd at beginning, till people realize how the quest design and mechanics work...then it is in worst case 6 vs 1 (friendly people) and a guardian group (usually p10/t4) to ward off non friends/guildies.

    I do not get how anyone would think with these numbers of people who can profit from the event IDEALLY, that it attracts a huge crowd in the long run. If you are not part of the winning side, the only motivation you get is "fighting for fighting sake" or "fighting against the odds" or "dying a lot". The first you can get easily on any non event day as well. The second too. As the third. So, why should weaker chars or members of non-dominating guilds and non-cheaters who think they can fight 1 vs 6+ even come and participate in the events, if the reward is being trolled, waiting, disappointment, crashing and a waste of real life time??? Or do you count on the "lottery effect" (1 000 000 participants, even only a handfull of winners)?? Even there the amount of participants would be reduced drastically fast, as soon as the million realizes the handfull of winners are always the same.

    Sure, one can more easily manage the daily pvp quests because people are more likely to be mounted and easier targets at event time...but again...daily quests i can do daily anyway AT MY leisure, not only when the powers that be allow it (or are not online).
    Also i believe in general boosting the pvp xp drastically for fighting during these events should help. But that boost factor should again be linked to challenge. And to avoid abuse and farming, introduce a measure of risk and activity (the longer a fight takes the more xp, the more powerfull the enemy the more xp, the more damage you do (minus heals) the more xp etc. etc.). This might not look easy and for sure would require some testing, but it will be worth it for all pvp aspects.
    Last edited by Kurt2013; 19th October 2014 at 10:39.

  3. #3

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    Mate if you check pic you would know that my biggest issue is alt farming that is going on which leads to high lvl chars like the one in the picture with almost no mini games or active pvp at all.
    Idk what would solution to that be but its worse than bori since there you could at least be challenged and some pvp occasionally would happen. Here there is one guild that just kill their own alts whole day long.
    I mean pvp 9 char with 20 mini games is bit silly.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by viroku View Post
    I love pvp daily quest and weekly festival but there are some issues.
    As picture say more than words here it is:
    http://www.truimagz.com/host/viroku/...picture100.png

    Idk solution to this but its almost worse than bori.
    I've seen a lot of that lately...is sad....

  5. #5

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    The guy on that picture usually plays ranger and doesn't Perform so well , if you know what I mean . For his own sake he farms alts with his other characters :b .
    However , since most of those guys are pvp 8+ and still quite low I don't really mind.
    Just corpsejump them after a kill
    Typing on mobile
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  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by viroku View Post
    Mate if you check pic you would know that my biggest issue is alt farming that is going on which leads to high lvl chars like the one in the picture with almost no mini games or active pvp at all.
    Idk what would solution to that be but its worse than bori since there you could at least be challenged and some pvp occasionally would happen. Here there is one guild that just kill their own alts whole day long.
    I mean pvp 9 char with 20 mini games is bit silly.
    They can still be challenged in theory...but i agree it is like Bori. But like Bori, it is fixable with redesigning. This was my point. Usually the alt-farming is solved with population (as with fightclubbing on white sands) or offering faster more fun ways to progress. But when the design locks out people and favours domination by a handfull of people...then you get what you see now (the fightclubbers and big guilds dominating).

  7. #7

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    We do hunt them but we can't be there 24/7 plus they're using a glitch to farm in instances where people aren't supposed to be.
    Expert Shield of the Risen opener.

  8. #8

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    Fight clubbing in these places is pretty funny. You go and kill them and bots a few times, they res out another area, then the search begins again. So fun...

    Wait. I don't think this is an issue. I don't have an issue where in a pvp mini etc it's pvp 10 geared vs pvp 10. Even if they did bori/exploit to it. I'd rather have that then pvp 10 vs pvp 0-4 without t4, etc.
    Last edited by Mathieulombardi; 20th October 2014 at 19:20.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathieulombardi View Post
    Fight clubbing in these places is pretty funny. You go and kill them and bots a few times, they res out another area, then the search begins again. So fun...

    Wait. I don't think this is an issue. I don't have an issue where in a pvp mini etc it's pvp 10 geared vs pvp 10. Even if they did bori/exploit to it. I'd rather have that then pvp 10 vs pvp 0-4 without t4, etc.
    Again: The design works against it. It is favoring boosting people to p10, while locking out a majority of players who want to get to p10 by legit means.

    I have no problem with people farming or fightclubbing as long as they use it to shorten a power gap (because the power gap reduces population and competition. E.g. there is a huge difference, if two players farm each other who have no powerful chars and just want to experience the higher pvp tiers someday OR if one powerful alt helps to boost his/her less powerfull alt to raise the new flavor of month char up to reduce competition.). The main problem with farming and fightclubbing comes, when the already powerfull and dominating groups use it to strengthen their numbers and drive off regular players (similar as with ganking players who only start it, when they got instanced gained gear (sanctum or t4) and pieces of pvp armor). Of course it would be nicer, if the first mentioned farmers would go and participate in the events with the other players, but the design and power gap make this very tough. Especially since it is NOT in the interest of the powerful group to let them be part of the chosen 4 or 6 players who actually gain something for their time invested. Thus the first type of farming is used to keep competition alive, while the second type is used to reduce it. Also the first type is easily disruptible, while the second type is a cancer.

    Both are not ideal, but one is worse. Both CAN be adressed with design. The thing here is, that you can not force people to fight in the events and participation numbers are bound to stay low in longterm, until the event quest design is changed or some consequence system is introduced. Simply because if the choice is "spend a lot of time waiting and fighting for almost nothing, strengthening my enemies" or "do something proper in real life or on crom", guess what people will do? Where is the benefit for the powerful groups on fury or funcom in there? So please again, do something to offer victory tokens (or participation tokens), better xp than during farming and quests for participation alone. Unless of course you WANT to keep p10 pvp only for a limited circle of a chosen few open only for new players, if they lick someones boots...making THIS more important than paying money to funcom OR spending time ingame (solo or with others) focusing on that goal (i understand and accept that this sounds positive and understandable, if you are a guild leader or part of the powerful group, but funcom? they do not benefit from such domination fantasies and loose a lot of possible real life money this way (or rather have lost)).

    Sadly i am not very confident anymore, because it IS a very similar problem and discussion as was done when Bori was farmed and introduced. Powerful groups took over the farming and blocked it for others once they were done. Fighting over Bori is still not the fastest route per design here to pvp xp and tokens...so they did not fix the design for years, why should they fix it now for the pvp events?
    Last edited by Kurt2013; 21st October 2014 at 13:55.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Daraios View Post
    The guy on that picture usually plays ranger and doesn't Perform so well , if you know what I mean . For his own sake he farms alts with his other characters :b .
    However , since most of those guys are pvp 8+ and still quite low I don't really mind.
    Just corpsejump them after a kill
    Yes I have reported this person before, their entire guild does it (all 4 of them). Of course he started this after destroying all the decorations in our guild city and booting everyone he could. I hate this person.

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