Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 31

Thread: Some ranger tweak suggestions

  1. #21

    Default

    I don't think the bad have stayed really.

    But the class is really newbie friendly. Even with **** stuff and near zero skill, you can manage to get few kills and very few deaths by KD whoring a lot. That's what is attracting some people.

    By the way, what happened to the advocate thingy ?
    Last edited by Religolibri; 21st September 2013 at 17:16.

  2. #22

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aell View Post
    Dump melee?
    it was already dumped nice going mr class speaker

    Differentiate crossbow from bow?
    as in one of the things most people even people without having ranger as main realy did like.

    You people are deranged. Or you should all go roll demos.
    why roll a demo it doesnt have taking the shot able to take more then a third of any class health in an instant cast spell
    (oh wait t4 gear+wave of flames...humm still not as good as taking the shot because tts is instant )

    First - a ranger is not a ranger because he fights at range. A ranger is a ranger because he ranges - ie he moves around, he is a scout, a skirmisher. A skirmisher who can't fight hand to hand is dead meat.
    i actualy agree with you, i even used tortage combos strafing around target at close range back when ranger was actualy a combo based class.

    Second - the moment you make crossbow different from bow you introduce a different and exclusive set of mechanics in one class. This means that essentially, you no longer have to balance twelve classes; you now have to balance thirteen classes. This adds an order of magnitude to the balancing calculations which are already nuts what with all the AAs and gear boosts and perks and the rest of the bullshít.
    i guess your one of those guys responsible for removing this great thing wich was balanced already from start by slower animations and higher dps on xbows
    i would hate you but i moved on long ago to bear shaman dt guard and necro as my mains to have any hate towards anyone responsible for destruction of ranger class.

    Third - no two classes are equal. None. Nothing is balanced. So really, you're asking for crossbow to be more powerful than bow, or vice versa. Which is bloody stupid and you should be embarrassed at how dumb you are.
    xbow was more powerfull then bow in old ranger wich was great and balanced because bow animations were faster, xbow in pvp toke more skill then bow both trees were great in pvp and pve with xbow dealing higher damage+ some cone aoe while bow better for single target.
    but wait your a superior mind who cant tell the diference in crossbow and bow, wich are btw bow faster relaods and ability to reliably use it on horseback, xbow better penetration and slower reloads not so reliable in mounted combat


    Fourth - without melee, a ranger is just a spellcaster. If I wanted a wizard I would play a wizard. Just because melee is too hard for you doesn't mean it's beyond the wit of other players.
    ranger is right now a mage for all efects it has no combos anymore.
    congrats mr class speaker again on your awesome qq destroying class.

    Jesus. Back when I was ranger advo, there were some truly terrible rangers. I see those are the ones that stayed.
    jesus blesses you for gimping ranger to its sad form without combos and ultra op easy mode for any noobs, it features taking the shot commonly refeared as taking the shiit just to make sure bad players can get kills and feel awesome
    i have a guildie who swears justin bieber plays ranger it sounds legit
    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-t0-DaNcj3i...00/justinb.jpg

    just to add i actualy like your idea of one feat tree just for melee combat and second tree for box/xbow, one small catch it would require full reintegration of melee combat system back to ranger not this stupid buffing system.
    Last edited by noite80; 21st September 2013 at 18:18.
    FORUM PVP LVL 10

  3. #23

    Default

    I quit as advocate long before the revamp, incidentally.

    vheffner and the other guy were not consulted on it, either. It just happened.

    You can blame whoever you like, but this one's not on me.

    And incidentally, if one ranger can do 1000dps to one target and one ranger can do 1000dps to 6 targets, the classes are not balanced and you know it.

    All this QQ is just from people who loved their OP crossbows.

    Quote Originally Posted by noite80 View Post
    just to add i actualy like your idea of one feat tree just for melee combat and second tree for box/xbow, one small catch it would require full reintegration of melee combat system back to ranger not this stupid buffing system.
    Which I would fully support, although actually I feel that the combo system is broken anyway.

    The way it should work is not starter->direction->direction but rather direction->direction->direction. As long as there are hotkeys for combo starters, it falls short of even the crappiest beat-em-up.
    Last edited by Aell; 21st September 2013 at 18:41.
    shoryuken

  4. #24

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aell View Post
    Dump melee?

    Differentiate crossbow from bow?

    You people are deranged. Or you should all go roll demos.

    First - a ranger is not a ranger because he fights at range. A ranger is a ranger because he ranges - ie he moves around, he is a scout, a skirmisher. A skirmisher who can't fight hand to hand is dead meat.

    Second - the moment you make crossbow different from bow you introduce a different and exclusive set of mechanics in one class. This means that essentially, you no longer have to balance twelve classes; you now have to balance thirteen classes. This adds an order of magnitude to the balancing calculations which are already nuts what with all the AAs and gear boosts and perks and the rest of the bullshít.

    Third - no two classes are equal. None. Nothing is balanced. So really, you're asking for crossbow to be more powerful than bow, or vice versa. Which is bloody stupid and you should be embarrassed at how dumb you are.

    Fourth - without melee, a ranger is just a spellcaster. If I wanted a wizard I would play a wizard. Just because melee is too hard for you doesn't mean it's beyond the wit of other players.

    Jesus. Back when I was ranger advo, there were some truly terrible rangers. I see those are the ones that stayed.
    First, Agree about the ranging part. Not much to add there.

    Second, you already have 24 classes of which 12 can be combined with other 12 for hybrids. Other classes have completely different mechanics and options, depending on feat tree too. So no, it would not be a bad idea to introduce different mechanics (for example crossbow could have longer reload, but better aim options and instant release, while bow would allow for better movement but also require more effort to aim). Suggestions on how it would work have been made before ranger revamp and later again on TL.

    Third, of course classes are not equal. But this does not rule out balancing. If you ever played (or designed) a game where you can create your own "classes" or have a classless pointbased system, you'd know. This is a "dead strike" and unserious argument...like "the world is bad", so i just lay back and do nothing.

    Fourth, indeed. Completely agreed here. Ranger as unique ranged physical class offers the chance for an interesting unique go at ranged weapons...but funcom messed it up with the instacombo revamp

  5. #25

    Default

    There are 7 melee classes in the game atm... one healer, one mage, three soldiers, and two rogues. If I wanted to play a melee toon, there are lots of opportunities for me. However, I like to play a ranged toon, so I've tried them all... necro, ToS, demo and PoM and found that, of them all, I like the ranger the most. Although posters say the ranger is dumb and easy to play, I find it takes more skill than any of the other ranged classes, and ditto for most of the other melee classes, which I have also played.

    If I can shoot my bow or xbow at close range, I don't give a flying f about melee. If anything, it would be far more sensible, imo, to differentiate ranger combos by range... some would be activated at close range, others at a distance, and to build the two ranger trees to support one style or the other. Traps and ccs would be more appropriate in the close-range tree; higher dps would be in the long-range tree. All combos could be accessible with either bow or xbow, but could be buffed by one or other other, so one weapon would contribute to dps, and the other to CCs.

    However, that or improved melee is not likely to happen. And the one thing I hope will never change is a return to the old-style combo system where you have to initiate a combo and then follow through with a pre-determined set of white shots. Cause the thing I love most about playing the ranger is deciding for myself what and how I'm going to customize my combo before I trigger it and that is truly a unique and fun feature of the class.

  6. #26

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GeneralFear View Post
    Although posters say the ranger is dumb and easy to play, I find it takes more skill than any of the other ranged classes, and ditto for most of the other melee classes, which I have also played.
    ah my bad...
    other ranged classes.
    demo/necro use cloth armor, ranger medium armor
    pom/tos have light armor, ranger medium armor
    any of them require double to triple amount of keybinds, especily high on tos&necro a bit less but still a lot more on demo&pom

    2 of those classes are healers so they have added complexity with inbued team support abilities, meaning situational awareness is more demanding then on ranged dps

    necro/demo have simple mechanics although necromancer has a lot more gameplay possibilities like frenzy pet to help tanks in pve and some small team wide bonuses for team from using particular minions, while demo has more cc's and more mobility with instant cast spells
    none of them have anything close to burst dps capability of ranger.
    you do a duel demo/necro vs ranger with both using best gear possible aka t4 gear ranger wins in seconds with superior range kb+ down buffed pen shot + taking the shot

    so yeah takes so much more skill to play ranger ...

    i find it truely strange that you find that it takes more skill to play ranger compared to melee, i can only phantom that you realy simply couldnt enjoy melees they were too complicated for you, pure and simple having to think wich combos and wich combo rank to use depending on shields position and having to do combo steps...


    If I can shoot my bow or xbow at close range, I don't give a flying f about melee.
    yeah i gather doing combos is too hard and ranger buf up and down ignoring the whole aoc combat system is so much better, despite fact mere essense of ranger is to be able to alternate from range to melee in seconds, its ranger not not archer i think you have it confused with some of those generic mindless mmo's for teens full of fairies.

    However, that or improved melee is not likely to happen. And the one thing I hope will never change is a return to the old-style combo system where you have to initiate a combo and then follow through with a pre-determined set of white shots. Cause the thing I love most about playing the ranger is deciding for myself what and how I'm going to customize my combo before I trigger it and that is truly a unique and fun feature of the class.
    awww
    last game director wich made this stupidity must be so proud reading someone who claims ranger takes more skill to play and has awesome combat mechanics

    sorry man you simple have no clue just how awesome the aoc combat combo system is and clearly you dont know just how much more fun old ranger with combos was.
    FORUM PVP LVL 10

  7. #27

    Default

    I don't think I've confused the AoC ranger with other fantasy games. If melee was supposed to be so important to ranger combat in AoC, you'd think they would have made a minimum range for bow/xbow so rangers had to switch to melee at close range... sorta like they do in WoW as I recall. Hey, why not add some ranger pets too while you're at it?

    TBH, I don't ever pvp in this game, so maybe a lot of the comments are directed to that end. But, for solo pve and raid pve, I have played ToS, Necro, HoX and Ranger to T4. To equal or better the dps on those toons takes a lot more effort and strategy for the ranger... just my opinion though. Having more keybinds doesn't make a toon more challenging to play... in fact, a case could be made that it's harder with fewer ones, since you have many fewer options at your disposal. A barb or DT with 6 or 7 abilities that can be rapid-fired one after the other isn't necessarily harder than a ranger with two advantages, one of which can only be fired once every 35 long seconds.

    I never need to switch targets and reposition my toon when playing any of the other toons... just ccs, aoes and fall asleep. I've soloed the Battle of Set many times, but most difficult one ever was with ranger. And anyway, I don't ever recall anyone looking for a ranger to PL them in DMC. But necro, demo, and ToS? Sure... so which is better set up for dps and mass CC?

    It's very rare for someone looking for a rogue for K6 to ask for ranger... always sin or barb. It's that because it's too easy to play a ranger? Or because it's more difficult, though possible, for a ranger to equal or better their dps.

    For melee, I've mostly played a HoX, but also bear shaman, DT and barb. They're all basically the same to me... once I had a good rotation and some decent gear, they're fairly routine. It's very nice to have a combo ui to show you what key to press and when, btw, compared to the ranger buffs where you have to try to filter them out from all the other crazy buffs in the game.

    Anyway, I admit I'm not an elite player... though I think I'm competent and usually come at or near the top of parses no matter what toon I play. I can't comment on the pvp side of things, but in my experience for pve, the current ranger, with its unique play style of buffed combos, is much more entertaining to play than standing more or less in one place firing off hot buttons in a memorized, predetermined order... no matter how many buttons you have at your disposal.

  8. #28

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GeneralFear View Post
    For melee, I've mostly played a HoX, but also bear shaman, DT and barb. They're all basically the same to me...
    you dont get it do you?
    ranger had multiple combos with diferent atack finishers so it could use combos to exploit unshielded side, like rest of melee classes this is particularly important in pve dps to improve performance and its inherent to aoc only, where shields on target and combos are used.

    there is no rotation the shields on target dictate which combo and combo rank to use for optimized gain.

    you start you combo with opener you have a few seconds to adjust your position and do finisher or other combo steps while on the move strafing around your oponent if needed or more advantageous according to situation.

    this is something i think bow should get the ability to do white hits while moving like rest of melees who can do directional atacks while moving but having all ingame bows with lower base dps then xbows wich should remain like now needing stationarity to use any white hits(directional atacks)
    bow combos and i mean combos not buffing up crap should be 1-2 steps while xbow combos 2-3 steps with higher damage from xbow higher weapon damage and increase penetration rating buff while having xbow equiped.
    it could work like dt's talisman mastery granting bow ability to use directional atacks on the move if you have bow equiped and having xbow equiped grant higher armor penetration buff while its equiped and dont allow for directional atacks to be done while moving.
    but a whole tree just for melee improvements is also what class realy needs with some 2-3 step combos some cc endfeats like now and all the traps be tied to xbow/bow end feat tree only feats, so you whouldnt be able to get traps while melee feated and not be able to get melee end feat cc's and improved melee dps with improved ranged end feat cc's like linebreaker or incendiary shot.
    also some charge mid range ability for melee ranger.

    ranger current pve "rotation-2 is just boring go near target use trap, target something far away for cone damage up arrow+down arrow use pen shot, up arrow down arrow + bleeding punture use ability or another trap up down pen shot again if bp on cooldown quick shots down buffed only

    how does that compare with any combo using class?
    it doesnt.
    how does that compare with old class where it was combo based and you had truely diferenciated bow crossbow trees with combo ranks and distinct combo finisher directions?
    it doesnt.

    btw hunting hawk is your ranger pet perk.
    you say wow has this no surprise last game director was big wow fan and spent last months of his leadership praising other games in twitter while neglecting aoc.
    FORUM PVP LVL 10

  9. #29

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by noite80 View Post
    you start you combo with opener you have a few seconds to adjust your position and do finisher or other combo steps while on the move strafing around your oponent if needed or more advantageous according to situation.
    I don't ever see this happening, and I've been on a lot of raids and 6-mans with a lot of different guilds since I first started playing this game in 2008. Heck, I don't even see other rangers moving around to hit multiple targets with their pen shots. But no matter... I'm just gonna go have fun playing ranger as it is now and let others feel they're the skillful ones playing the "real" AoC. Given the way things are going, I don't think I have to worry about any changes being made that I don't want to see for a good long time.

  10. #30

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GeneralFear View Post
    I don't ever see this happening, and I've been on a lot of raids and 6-mans with a lot of different guilds since I first started playing this game in 2008. Heck, I don't even see other rangers moving around to hit multiple targets with their pen shots.
    im not surprised given you saying that ranger takes more skill to play then rest of melees .
    but that is how you gain more dps with ranger target furthest away with targets in between and do pen shot and atack side with less shields, behind or if its not possible with combo doing finisher hit on side wich doesnt have a shield.
    its also usefull that combo starters dont have same initial hit as finisher blow to maintain shields on same side while doing finisher on unshielded, and some particular combo starters have higher damage then others depending on feats and class.
    FORUM PVP LVL 10

Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •