maximise cash shop start selling gold and crafted weapons

[kalston]

So the point of this thread is "since there are people already buying and consuming drugs we should legalize them"?

Did I understand correctly?
Good logic, grats!

You do realize this is actually a real debate in some countries and that there's nothing stupid about it? Making it legal & under control instead of letting the blackmarket take care of it is certainly not a bad idea (I'm not saying it's without flaws either).

And I would argue that it worked quite well for Diablo 3, the game sold millions of copies and probably still keeps more players than AoC and it's not even a MMO. What made many quit is rather the lack of content (not much to do besides hunting items, and there's not much variety in item looks either etc...)

Honestly I would be happy if they did that on AoC since so many buy off those illegal sites that's it's really quite sad for FC. I don't spend money on the shop so I wouldn't be one of those who buy those items anyway but I would feel better for FC (even if we don't know what they would really use the money for).

And I'm sorry but the amount of "in-game work" (or gold) required for t3 crafted items is certainly ridiculous, especially considering how easy t4 is (and t4 weapons are somewhat similar in power or even a bit better) and how stupidly good they are for pvp. They could also reduce the gear gap in pvp and that would discourage a lot of buyers
(I can't really imagine too many pvers buying those with real money, but pvpers who don't raid are certainly likely candidates and I know a few)

[Chaman-bourru]

I'm not fond of the idea... But ingame economy is completely screwed anyway. Crafting is tedious and outdated.

I do have hopes that craft revamp will solve that... but it's not coming anytime soon...

[Redd]

You do realize this is actually a real debate in some countries and that there's nothing stupid about it? Making it legal & under control instead of letting the blackmarket take care of it is certainly not a bad idea (I'm not saying it's without flaws either).

And I would argue that it worked quite well for Diablo 3, the game sold millions of copies and probably still keeps more players than AoC and it's not even a MMO. What made many quit is rather the lack of content (not much to do besides hunting items, and there's not much variety in item looks either etc...)

Honestly I would be happy if they did that on AoC since so many buy off those illegal sites that's it's really quite sad for FC. I don't spend money on the shop so I wouldn't be one of those who buy those items anyway but I would feel better for FC (even if we don't know what they would really use the money for).

And I'm sorry but the amount of "in-game work" (or gold) required for t3 crafted items is certainly ridiculous, especially considering how easy t4 is (and t4 weapons are somewhat similar in power or even a bit better) and how stupidly good they are for pvp. They could also reduce the gear gap in pvp and that would discourage a lot of buyers
(I can't really imagine too many pvers buying those with real money, but pvpers who don't raid are certainly likely candidates and I know a few)

Do you realize that Diablo 3 sold 13 millions copies only thanks to the hype made by Diablo 2, and that it lost around 90% if its population in first year?

Thats how great it worked.

[Pondtus]

No.

Funcom making them availabe in the store is basically saying "yes we think it's good to buy stuff to win"
Yes it happens but it's not a large number of players and Funcom at least displays the position that it does not condone such behavior.

If T4 weapons are "so easy to farm" then why would you want to buy a crafted item anyway?
How is that an argument to sell these items in the store?
Same as "in game work required is ridiculous", then don't get one!

Is it just me or do people all of a sudden feel entitled to stuff just because they play? Guess what people you don't get a participation award and not everyone is a winner. School may have told you so but life will teach you differently.
You want something? Do the work.

[KullOfValusia]

No.

Funcom making them availabe in the store is basically saying "yes we think it's good to buy stuff to win"
Yes it happens but it's not a large number of players and Funcom at least displays the position that it does not condone such behavior.

If T4 weapons are "so easy to farm" then why would you want to buy a crafted item anyway?
How is that an argument to sell these items in the store?
Same as "in game work required is ridiculous", then don't get one!

Is it just me or do people all of a sudden feel entitled to stuff just because they play? Guess what people you don't get a participation award and not everyone is a winner. School may have told you so but life will teach you differently.
You want something? Do the work.

since when is playing a video game considered work? I would imagine paying for something with RL dollars would be work...since you actually have to work for RL money.

[kalston]

Do you realize that Diablo 3 sold 13 millions copies only thanks to the hype made by Diablo 2, and that it lost around 90% if its population in first year?

Thats how great it worked.

And you think that's because of the auction house and (optional) use of real money? And if your numbers are right there's still 1.3 million people playing it, that's pretty good for what is basically a single player with very limited content (pvp is a joke, grouping is only an option, campaign is short, very few classes...). And don't get me started on how much money Blizzard made with 13 million copies + the auction house.

So yes, it was definitely a success and worked. You may like their games or not but Blizzard is insanely good at what it does. Diablo 3 doesn't have a monthly sub so player retention isn't as important as in a MMO. They'll also probably release an expansion pack at some point and bring tons of players back for a while... and sell millions of copies again.

If T4 weapons are "so easy to farm" then why would you want to buy a crafted item anyway?

Cos you need to raid to get them. That's not possible and not enjoyable for everyone, you know? Pvpers in particular may not want or may not be able to raid to get the best gear. The issue at hand here has much to do with pvp: gear matters a lot and to be truly competitive it is definitely tempting to get your hands on t2/t3 crafted (unless you can do raids in which case just be patient and go for t4). I'd love to get a t3 crafted or t4 pole on my guard, but I hate raiding and do it once a month and I'm certainly not going to grind thousands of gold either (I spend the vast majority of my time pvping). I'm also not going to spend real money on that. But the fact is many just go ahead and just pull the credit card out. Even some of the best pvpers of Fury have actually bought items or gold, it's maybe sad to read but it's absolutely true.

On the other hand gold buying in MMOs is really common even on pve servers. Random article after 10 secs of googling : https://www.google.fr/search?client=...w+common+is+it

[Jaedelyia]

And you think that's because of the auction house and (optional) use of real money? And if your numbers are right there's still 1.3 million people playing it, that's pretty good for what is basically a single player with very limited content (pvp is a joke, grouping is only an option, campaign is short, very few classes...). And don't get me started on how much money Blizzard made with 13 million copies + the auction house.

So yes, it was definitely a success and worked. You may like their games or not but Blizzard is insanely good at what it does. Diablo 3 doesn't have a monthly sub so player retention isn't as important as in a MMO. They'll also probably release an expansion pack at some point and bring tons of players back for a while... and sell millions of copies again.

I have to agree with Redd on that one. You can't say that Diablo3 was a success and worked thanks to its economic system. If anything, it was a success despite it. They sold 13 million copies thanks to the wonderfully addiction that was Diablo II, not thanks to stupid RMAH. So you can call the game a commercial success, but I wouldn't call the Economic model a commercial success. (at least not for the long term viability)

And yes, Diablo 3 hype faded away really quickly due to AH. Well, actually, the direct cause was the very very poorly designed looting system and item randomization, but Blizzard designed these system were in a way that made the AH shopping mandatory so they could earn money, so one can arguably defend that, ultimately, the paytowin system drive Diablo 3 down to some abyss of gamers's spite. Obviously, this unpopularity is all relative. You can say that 1,3 million players is still super neat, and it would be kinda true, but it IS bad for a blizzard game named Diablo, and it's longevity is bad compared to Diablo II which was still very played years after the release.

[kalston]

I have to agree with Redd on that one. You can't say that Diablo3 was a success and worked thanks to its economic system.

I didn't say that, or at least I didn't mean that. I just said that Blizzard made tons of money from it so it's for sure a commercial success. But I'm sure they had better expectations than to just keep 10% of their original playerbase (I should probably check those numbers but I honestly stopped caring about D3 1 month after its release since that was enough for me to get sick of it). But it's not the economical model that killed it (you can play the game solo without ever touching the AH, and many did and still do) but rather the game itself. No one forced you to use the AH with real money.
Blizzard put it there since they knew transactions with real money would happen regardless so they thought they might as well make it legal and make a little extra money from it.

This thread isn't about Diablo 3 though