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Thread: Agro

  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Areana View Post
    I'm a bit intrigued by that. As a tank your goal is to provide a high aggro level for your damage dealers (and some healers) and not to play aggro lock games vs other tanks. So there's nothing wrong with Call to Arms even if aggro will switch to another tank. As long as it stays on the tanks and doesn't switch to the damage dealers, everything's fine.
    Sure, but the things is not to lock yourself away from the aggro.

    If a DT tank is getting seriously hit, and you, as a guard, try to take the aggro back: With Call to Arm, you might give more aggro to the DT (since his aggro is DPS based) than what the pure hate buff CtA gives you. The situation is now worse, since the DT which had the aggro is now about to die and you still don't have aggro

    So yeah, Call To Arm can be useful but I think Buyten was just saying you should be careful whit it.

  2. #12

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    I'd use Goad in that situation and CtA as well if ready. This way I'd profit as well from the nice aggro the DT has done and not getting aggro won't be an issue.
    Defon (Guard)
    Nejoo (Guard) Areana (DT) Willamus (Conq)
    Ichkruchka (Demo) Defina (Necro) Defhid (HoX)
    Sagittaa (Ranger) Phaictan (Sin) Alunn (Barb)
    Defure (BS) Deforia (PoM) Nutiaret (ToS)

  3. #13

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    If a DT or Conq is about to die and is still attacking generating aggro then they deserve to die! Tools like Active Block reduce threat generation and people need to learn to better control their threat by knowing when to slow up or pass aggro to another tank. I've seen a lot of tanks complaining about aggro passing but a large majority don't under stand when to start letting the other tanks take the threat.

    My main is a Carnage Conq and I am constantly changing stances and tempo to lessen my chance of pulling aggro.

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bladestryke View Post
    If a DT or Conq is about to die and is still attacking generating aggro then they deserve to die!
    Well, this is where the tanking philosophy of our guild and that of most other raids I know of differ. We want our tanks to slow down or hold back as few times as possible to generate a high amount of thread. In my opinion this DT or Conq only deserves to die, if no hard spot/Dread Shadow is available. Otherwise I'd expect him to continue to do damage.

    I'm not saying that you're wrong, just that there's also another way to do it (But I think our way is more fun ).

    I do think that Active Blocking is highly overrated, though. It only reduces thread generation because you don't do damage any more.
    Last edited by Areana; 8th June 2013 at 09:45.
    Defon (Guard)
    Nejoo (Guard) Areana (DT) Willamus (Conq)
    Ichkruchka (Demo) Defina (Necro) Defhid (HoX)
    Sagittaa (Ranger) Phaictan (Sin) Alunn (Barb)
    Defure (BS) Deforia (PoM) Nutiaret (ToS)

  5. #15

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    If a DT is dying and stops attacking, they'll die even faster without the health taps coming in. This is when you want to use all your burst hate tools rather than ask the DT to back off.

  6. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bvis View Post
    If a DT is dying and stops attacking, they'll die even faster without the health taps coming in. This is when you want to use all your burst hate tools rather than ask the DT to back off.
    QFT

    /10chars

  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bvis View Post
    If a DT is dying and stops attacking, they'll die even faster without the health taps coming in. This is when you want to use all your burst hate tools rather than ask the DT to back off.
    A dt doesnt need to stop attacking. It can however slowdown, Change up combos, change up stances. If the guards are constanting generating agro a slowdown by the dts should swap it to the guards.
    Dts just need to learn when to slowdown and how good there guards are.

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buyten View Post
    A few tips for you as I don't know how you play.

    - Shield Slam + Irritate and Cry of Havoc while executing combo is the biggest hatebuff you have. Use Stall the Advance or Cunning Deflection once you get agro for high hate retributive damage. KEEP ON COOLDOWN ALWAYS.
    Stall or cunning d always on cooldown??? Sounds great til you need to swap agro. Thats just bad advice.
    Learn to play without using those.

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylis View Post
    A dt doesnt need to stop attacking. It can however slowdown, Change up combos, change up stances. If the guards are constanting generating agro a slowdown by the dts should swap it to the guards.
    Dts just need to learn when to slowdown and how good there guards are.
    Speaking as someone who plays both a guard and DT
    (with a fresh lvl 80 conq so I can't speak in terms of playing them) I don't think the problem lays in the guards agro generation ability (sure it could do with something to help on bosses that take more damage) but it's the mindset of the player more so than a class problem (I've been locked out by other soldiers and so long as they're not dying I don't mind it in the slightest).

    There are fights where a guard will struggle to hold agro off of a good Conq or DT, suck it up and stop blowing all your agro tools trying to keep it off them. In my opinion the difference between a good soldier and a bad one is recognizing when another soldier is generating more threat than you are and putting your ego on the shelf. That way you have the tools available to you to take the boss or mob off them when they need it rather than trying to rip it off them while they are still generating threat.

    If you keep doing combos, along with shield slam and cry of havoc but reserve irritate, forced engage plus Goad for when the other tank is ready to let go then you have a high level of threat and tools available to take agro when needed. On the other hand if you use everything when they are still generating a high level of threat then you're highly unlikely to keep agro for any worth while amount of time, usually one hit if that, then when they die it's not their fault you couldn't accept that they were generating more threat than you, that's your fault.

    On my DT I regularly swap agro with other soldiers by not doing a combo for a second or 2 then start doing combos again till the boss swaps back to me, if I need to save them adding an irritate (or seal of chaos because I'm not spamming them to keep my name as targets target) in with a combo usually does the job, I play my guard the same way, I keep agro tools in reserve for swapping rather than trying to lock the target onto me, if he doesn't want to hit me then I'm not wasting all my tools to get 2 seconds of agro.

    I accept that my name doesn't have to be targets target to be doing my job on any of my soldiers unless the other soldier needs the target taken off of them, the boss or mob is not wrecking the dps in the raid or 6 man so how are you failing as a soldier if the other soldier is able to generate more threat than you are?

  10. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bladestryke
    Tools like Active Block reduce threat generation and people need to learn to better control their threat by knowing when to slow up or pass aggro to another tank.
    Some new myth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aylis View Post
    ...change up stances...
    Like from defensive to frenzy while being hit by boss? :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Aylis View Post
    Dts just need to learn when to slowdown and how good there guards are.
    Partially true. From what I understand OP would like to press one combo and have top aggro. You can't whine you cannot get enough aggro because you want to press 1 button instead of 5, c'mon. Just as a side note OP should learn to switch maneuvers as well, so it might be 7 buttons ;-) But TBH that's what makes playing guard interesting... lots going on while tanking. I farmed khitai gear for my conq and you know what? It's so damn boring and slow that I now regret I did not spend my time to gear guard instead.
    Last edited by nedbee; 11th June 2013 at 08:28.
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