Most hated class?

[Suctum]

He's just another example of players that retain hate for casters from 1.5.

Necro has NEVER had decent CC's. The only thing was that back then their root would last 12 seconds and would not break on damage and I think the stun might have been instant.

In fact necro's are probably better off today because the gear available is much better than back then, the real damage comes from triple Icestrikes.

Lotus sins used to be annoying but not too many ran that spec 1.5. Those that did were totally beatable, and I understand why a revamp was needed. Rangers were total trash back then. Salvo, Flame Barrage, and Heartseeker being their only real tricks.

After 1.6 the game actually was pretty balanced minus some things like BV, but over all the game took the biggest dip 2.0 when they juiced up Rangers and Sins to instant win classes. 1 week after the Ranger revamp you would literally have 7-9 rangers per mini game. Rangers were so powerful that Puncture and Exhausting trap could kill you alone on the bleeds. There are still a few youtube vids of this...Sins were the same way because LO was proccing and the cooldown would start while it was active, so until they changed it, it was generaly a waste of time to even try to kill a Sin. Also, you could instantly mold snap kick with GC and outright 1-shot clothies.

There were too many things to complain about back then. Overall current days classes are somewhat better balanced but because of the overloaded T4 gear it's hard to tell what's OP and what's not because gear is such a factor now.

I still stand by my opinion that Ranger and Sin current day suffer the least from bad gear and limited AA. Unlike a soldier class that you need to get your at least your PvP T2 armor and grind faction acessories/weapons and AA, it takes only a portion of that comittment to get a Ranger or Sin instantly comepetitive.

[Mathieulombardi]

LOL I don't know what you guys are talking about. I have three casters that I play often and I have nothing against casters, nor do I ever have trouble with sins on them. Only thing I hate in pvp are tanks that play like pussies.

Suctum regards to your minimal gear and aa deal, none of it is plausible for a new rogue, esp on without a good guild to carry them through. Have you rolled a new 80? How do you get 3-6 points for free, cus' it's certainly not that many. Pressing and decisive both cost 2 just to spec 1 point. Both TW/FH takes forever to get, even if you do get carried through yag loops that have another rogue to do your work. Compare that to a demo or necro, do they have to get UC to go to yag? No. Demos will have an easier time to gain gear and AA than new rogues.

And you say it's about 2 weeks or less to be geared and AA'd enough on a rogue to be competitive? That's so off base. But by that logic, any demo, necro, dt can be the same with your "minimal AA and gear" erroneous description. So your opinion that sins and rangers suffer the least from bad gear and limited AA is wrong. Sins and rangers that spec tribrid with minimal AA and gear gets destroyed in pvp, demos necros and dts who do don't and are still "competitive". Here's my pve spec'd pvp 2 DT with your minimal gear and aa, with only 1 in vindication : http://i562.photobucket.com/albums/s...ps1ab28fc3.jpg
That was the last time I played it in pvp. I similarily gave up pvping on my conq. I rolled debt and can specifically b/c they were underpowered before, but they became jokes so I gave them up.

Calore, if you've ever faced a decent caster on a melee, what they do well is to chain their ccs and dmg spells together, necro, demo, the same. You can not only chain major and minor ccs on a necro, you can use pet stagger as well. Any time you get close, they pop off a certain cc and kite away.

BTW, LO is very very easy to deal with on a caster. I'm sure you know pvp is more about burst than sustained like pve. You can very well cc a sin, proc LO, kite away, wait til LO is up, then force all your burst dmg to burn it down when it has no immunity anymore. The only time it becomes a problem is when the sin know to stack LO with dull pain, b/c unless you kite to a teammate, or just have better movement than the sin, you can't do enough before one of the sin's cc or dmg cylce is up.

Btw, discuss what I say, not make assumptions about what I hate or haven't played caster vs good sin. I can talk out of my butt too but it won't be a discussion.

[SlightlyMad]

Demo has no bubbles, cloth armor and gets focused all the time.
CCs got resisted, broken or interrupted many times.
Try to play a demo in minigames and you will realize fast how much speedbuff is needed to survive.

Or you think that conqs, guards, DTs, BSs, PoMs would deserve a speedbuff more than demos?

Give me a break, I'd be about to cry for demos if I had no clue.

You are *ranged* and you dont deserve a speedbuff. period.

Talking about demo, with all CC resistances, breaks, etc, sometimes even a single melee can kill you (barb, conq etc.; no need to say sin).

Demo is very squishy, most times the best thing to do is use speed buff and run away (which is different than kite).

Even a single melee can kill demo *sometimes*, so? Do demos need to be focused to be killed? / they should always survive 1 on 1 situations?

Using speed buff to run away/survive... that's demos' defense on this? Only nab/coward demos who stays at range/depends on their pve gear to get kills, uses it to run away all the time.

Good demos uses it whenever it's off CD so they can easily: 1. Kite&nuke 2. Catch a running away target(you have the range for that and top of that the speed buff) 3. and lastly Escape.

It may seem like a survival tool but it's far from that. If a demo can have 10 kills in a mini, with using speedbuff all the time he can kill 15/more. It's a timesaver, use it, run around and start attacking on sight, never give a chance for him to heal up, chase him to hell.

[Suctum]

Give me a break, I'd be about to cry for demos if I had no clue.

You are *ranged* and you dont deserve a speedbuff. period.



Even a single melee can kill demo *sometimes*, so? Do demos need to be focused to be killed? / they should always survive 1 on 1 situations?

Using speed buff to run away/survive... that's demos' defense on this? Only nab/coward demos who stays at range/depends on their pve gear to get kills, uses it to run away all the time.

Good demos uses it whenever it's off CD so they can easily: 1. Kite&nuke 2. Catch a running away target(you have the range for that and top of that the speed buff) 3. and lastly Escape.

It may seem like a survival tool but it's far from that. If a demo can have 10 kills in a mini, with using speedbuff all the time he can kill 15/more. It's a timesaver, use it, run around and start attacking on sight, never give a chance for him to heal up, chase him to hell.

I can't argue with any of this, I very rarely use HotU to escape, it's more of a speed buff that I use to finish people off or get to the action sooner. If focused I use Planar Shift and Mystic Suspresion and some double tapping to survive.

Situationaly I will use it as a snare against flag carriers but that's only after I have exhausted every other CC. On the other hand it's still a problem to keep up with melee depsite sprint revamp and I find myself using Hands the most just to keep up with the tanks and Sins/Barbs.

[Suctum]

LOL I don't know what you guys are talking about. I have three casters that I play often and I have nothing against casters, nor do I ever have trouble with sins on them. Only thing I hate in pvp are tanks that play like pussies.

Suctum regards to your minimal gear and aa deal, none of it is plausible for a new rogue, esp on without a good guild to carry them through. Have you rolled a new 80? How do you get 3-6 points for free, cus' it's certainly not that many. Pressing and decisive both cost 2 just to spec 1 point. Both TW/FH takes forever to get, even if you do get carried through yag loops that have another rogue to do your work. Compare that to a demo or necro, do they have to get UC to go to yag? No. Demos will have an easier time to gain gear and AA than new rogues.

And you say it's about 2 weeks or less to be geared and AA'd enough on a rogue to be competitive? That's so off base. But by that logic, any demo, necro, dt can be the same with your "minimal AA and gear" erroneous description. So your opinion that sins and rangers suffer the least from bad gear and limited AA is wrong. Sins and rangers that spec tribrid with minimal AA and gear gets destroyed in pvp, demos necros and dts who do don't and are still "competitive". Here's my pve spec'd pvp 2 DT with your minimal gear and aa, with only 1 in vindication : http://i562.photobucket.com/albums/s...ps1ab28fc3.jpg
That was the last time I played it in pvp. I similarily gave up pvping on my conq. I rolled debt and can specifically b/c they were underpowered before, but they became jokes so I gave them up.

Calore, if you've ever faced a decent caster on a melee, what they do well is to chain their ccs and dmg spells together, necro, demo, the same. You can not only chain major and minor ccs on a necro, you can use pet stagger as well. Any time you get close, they pop off a certain cc and kite away.

BTW, LO is very very easy to deal with on a caster. I'm sure you know pvp is more about burst than sustained like pve. You can very well cc a sin, proc LO, kite away, wait til LO is up, then force all your burst dmg to burn it down when it has no immunity anymore. The only time it becomes a problem is when the sin know to stack LO with dull pain, b/c unless you kite to a teammate, or just have better movement than the sin, you can't do enough before one of the sin's cc or dmg cylce is up.

Btw, discuss what I say, not make assumptions about what I hate or haven't played caster vs good sin. I can talk out of my butt too but it won't be a discussion.

You do get 3-6 AA points for free, but not actually bought points. So with 6 AA points you can buy 6 wards at 1 point each and already start time training FH or TW. You can be carried through regular K6-mans like Warmonks and Palace. Once you get a few drops, you can move onto Yag. If you DO belong to a decent guild getting carried is not a problem. One of my guildies geared out his conq in full Faction Khitai gear in less than 3 weeks and has a T4 sword. You don't even need that much on a Ranger to be able to comepete.

As for those demo's wearing faction gear, they are a joke. They melt in seconds. I don't see any demo wearing PvE gear minus Balacai on his alt doing well. Whoever these demo's are I don't see them. Whenever I log to do minis, the only demo at the top of the list is me unless teams are totally unbalanced or someone like Fuzzy or Balacai are playing their alt demo's, amazing players who play multiple classes and who can be counted amongst the best of the US players. The average player just does not get on a demo and all of a sudden does well, while an average player can get on a ranger and to a lesser extent sin and still walk away with an even score.

I'll give you Sin since melee can eat them alive and so can a caster once LO is gone, but a ranger with some t1 and a yak bow with TTS will still hit people for 3-4K. No other class can approach those numbers without a huge investment into AA and gear grind. And getting one major perk with a combination of time training and AA points is not a big deal. With how much AA you get doing raids and quests, it's super easy to grind AA very, very quickly. Even rare tokens for that fact.

[Dodgeball]

As for those demo's wearing faction gear, they are a joke. They melt in seconds. I don't see any demo wearing PvE gear minus Balacai on his alt doing well. Whoever these demo's are I don't see them. Whenever I log to do minis, the only demo at the top of the list is me unless teams are totally unbalanced or someone like Fuzzy or Balacai are playing their alt demo's, amazing players who play multiple classes and who can be counted amongst the best of the US players. The average player just does not get on a demo and all of a sudden does well, while an average player can get on a ranger and to a lesser extent sin and still walk away with an even score.

Actually its not very hard to dominate a mini game playing a demo, its pretty faceroll and i am proof of that because im a pve baddie. I use PvP 7 main pieces and T4 minor pieces and manage to get 20-30 kills a mini consistantly, and it gets boring farming same people all day. I dont pvp anymore becuae I got my 20,000th kill in Memory cloud this week so no point/goal in pvp anymore.

[Suctum]

Actually its not very hard to dominate a mini game playing a demo, its pretty faceroll and i am proof of that because im a pve baddie. I use PvP 7 main pieces and T4 minor pieces and manage to get 20-30 kills a mini consistantly, and it gets boring farming same people all day. I dont pvp anymore becuae I got my 20,000th kill in Memory cloud this week so no point/goal in pvp anymore.

What does this have to do with anything I was talking about? Your somebody who has been playing a demo for a while, so your not included in what I am saying. Name all of these faceroll demo's on Set dominating minis...they must not be playing when I play because I do not see them.


PS: I was at 20,000 kills almost 3 years ago...how are you only at 20k now?

[Ruhenous]

What does this have to do with anything I was talking about? Your somebody who has been playing a demo for a while, so your not included in what I am saying. Name all of these faceroll demo's on Set dominating minis...they must not be playing when I play because I do not see them.


PS: I was at 20,000 kills almost 3 years ago...how are you only at 20k now?

I do well on my Demo in PvE gear. But I don't PvP on it often, because it's boring as hell.

[EmSi86]

must be necro ...

or t4 sin while you are clothie,

or guards on max vengence stacks, cta, polearm build, va with heals while you cant take them off and you only fight with 1h ;0

[mrcorp]

Actually its not very hard to dominate a mini game playing a demo, its pretty faceroll and i am proof of that because im a pve baddie. I use PvP 7 main pieces and T4 minor pieces and manage to get 20-30 kills a mini consistantly, and it gets boring farming same people all day. I dont pvp anymore becuae I got my 20,000th kill in Memory cloud this week so no point/goal in pvp anymore.

T4 gear on any class is faceroll.