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Thread: disavantage from conq revamp

  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by UnknownSoldier View Post
    i see zarini doing similar with his sin :
    saw him charge against a tos with a necro fulled with bombs side by side and a demo close by, and the tos got his health to around 10% or even less (not sure), the sin didnt even reached less than 70%-75% and run away and was attacked with demo and necro (tos started to run)

    so, charging against multiple targets togheter to kill a lowbie a run away and survive its not a problem only of the conqs, a lot of sins do the same
    sin is rogue, part of the play style, sneak and accel

    conq is a tank. shouldnt be dealing dmg, but rather taking it, right now it does both(thats why its OP)

  2. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chass- View Post
    nah conq is just fine

    /conq

    btw, dont fix BOA its fun like this.
    It was fun when it was insta-cast end of combo finisher KB effect. Why are devs so against it I couldnt understand, they messed up many times changing it then settled for noobie AoE cast.

    Brute conq in pve is where it needs to be, in pvp too much survivability. Devs should have removed one bubble/and gave a damage feat instead and lessened the cooldown time of the other one; instead they buffed both damage&survivability in spite of 2 bubbles.

    Brute conq&pom are ridiculously ridiculous in pvp. Personally in minigames; I rather ignore these classes' average&better players, and engage with other classes otherwise it takes too much time to kill em even when focused.
    Last edited by SlightlyMad; 27th March 2013 at 05:46.

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by SlightlyMad View Post
    It was fun when it was insta-cast end of combo finisher KB effect. Why are devs so against it I couldnt understand, they messed up many times changing it then settled for noobie AoE cast.
    Don't know if you're talking about the pre revamp version, or the pre CC-revamp version (where it could kb on white hit), that was even worse than the current one.
    Anyway, my guess for "why they settled for AoE noobie cast" is that the previous version was kind of a mess bug wise - not in a "game breaking exploit" way, but in a way that it was impossible to have its description match what it does - and it probably wasn't a good thing to leave it as an ability that is at best not very intuitive, at worst completely messed up. Noobie AoE cast is probably very much easier to maintain as far as bugs are concerned.

    I'm not saying that makes AoE cast Ok though. A version similar to the pre revamp one but with less bugs (hopefully none) and less pre-conditions (i.e. getting rid of the "need to hit with openener" condition), that has been asked for since the revamp was on TL, would probably have made everyone happy : conqs, and conqs haters
    -- Ieronon, QQror --
    -- Deutter, holy potato --

  4. #14

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    But conqs got nerfed - look at their protection.

  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Misiuggah View Post
    But conqs got nerfed - look at their protection.
    nerfed or not, the truth is there, currently they kill others like dpsers kills and AT THE SAME TIME survive like epic tanks, all soldiers do that, not just the conq, but its absord how easily soldiers overpower everything in pvp, specially conq at the moment, more than DT;

    they should simply be:
    tanks - very hard to kill but dont kill too much, meaning dps on pvp side lower, just for supporting dpsers a bit;
    be dpsers - kill ALMOST like rogues and mages, and being almost, makes them not dps as much as those classes but survive longer (heavy/plate armors)
    hybrids - combination of dps and tank (AKA offtanks)

    the healers should be the same, some for heal mainly, some for dps, some hybrid

    but currently in pvp i feel there's not a difference between classes you choose, you should a heal, you get a dps classe, you choose a tank, you also get a dps class, you choose a dps class, you get a hard time killing others??????

    dps classes basically attack other dpsers and only attack attack tanks/healers on group like wild hyenas, but no one (except a very few) attack them on 1vs1, why? cause healers and tanks survive way to long and can still kill them, here's the balance, where's the need for dps classes here? not saying that a healer/tank has to die on 1vs1 against dpsers, but if tanks are speced for tanking, they should not kill a dpser as easy as they currently do and vice-versa (on 1vs1 with same gear/level bla bla bla), tanks specked to tank, should require more than one dpser to kill them, sure (same for healers speced on healing), but tanks speced for dps should be well balanced against any dpser on 1vs1, but NO they have heavy armor with the same dps as mages/rogues against their cloth armors (sin and all mages), light (barbarians, that actually feel like cloth armor) or medium (ranger is an exception, stupid noob class currently)

    on a side note about what i just said, ive read on old forums that mages are gonna get revamp, i hope they make them true dpsers against tanks/healers instead of just attack other dpsers and leave tanks/healers alone - the sins are the only classe that i see that work as true dpsers in pvp, they attack and attack hard as it should be, rangers do it also but im not even talk about that specific class, and barbs, well barbs are a bit strange (i survive longer with my barb on pvp, playing in reaver stance with reave/general spec than zerker or hybrid as most pp play, strange, dunno why)

    i feel dps classes are currently the most useless classes in the game (at pve also this happens, just check combat logs and how tanks and some healers can stay on top, dps wise against the dpsers, even when they are tanking/healing mainly) - it looks like in the near future rogues/mages will become tanks/healers and the classes will simple disappear and only unique thing about them will be their name, combos/spells/abilities, off course with the exception that BIG HEALS only come from healers, BIG PUNISHMENTS to tanks but them the dpers, where to they come???

    should the reason to take rogues/mages to a KK run is for the their unique AA abilities!? other dungeons that dont require unique AA, just take a PoM and 5 tanks

    i know mages top parsers in raids (only), not in 6-man (im sure of that cause i do my own combat logs conclusions) and they get top kills in pvp minigames, but thats only cause they attack other mages or rogues, mages 1vs1 with any tank (tanked speced), mage always dead, ridiculous, 1vs1 against healers (specked to heal), mage always dead, ridiculous, 1vs1 against other mages/rogues its more balanced, thats better, may the skill/faster player win or the "counter class" wins...against a tank speced to dps or a healer speced to dps, the results should also be more similar like agaisnt dps classes, may the skill/speed/timing decide who wins

    P.S.: the stances on the soldiers is way to unbalanced, i dont play guard on pvp, only pve, but when im on frenzy with heavey armor, i get almost 30% armor (more than any dpser) and at least 400 base dps, and also i inflict critical hits more often on mobs than i do with my barb, and the barb is way better AA built and better armor, and then i change to defensive stance giving +50% armor and can then return to frenzy stance in less than 3 seconds...so, i can only imagine soldiers in pvp, each 3 seconds having huge dps or huge defense burst, no matter what feats they have - in my opinion a good solution to this would be changing the stas of the stances on the pvp side ONLY, cause on pve things are different and those 3 seconds stance change makes the difference, how hard it is to change that and throw it in test live so pp check if its good or not!???
    Last edited by UnknownSoldier; 27th March 2013 at 12:50.

  6. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by UnknownSoldier View Post
    nerfed or not, the truth is there, currently they kill others like dpsers kills and AT THE SAME TIME survive like epic tanks, all soldiers do that, not just the conq, but its absord how easily soldiers overpower everything in pvp, specially conq at the moment, more than DT;

    they should simply be:
    tanks - very hard to kill but dont kill too much, meaning dps on pvp side lower, just for supporting dpsers a bit;
    be dpsers - kill ALMOST like rogues and mages, and being almost, makes them not dps as much as those classes but survive longer (heavy/plate armors)
    hybrids - combination of dps and tank (AKA offtanks)

    the healers should be the same, some for heal mainly, some for dps, some hybrid

    but currently in pvp i feel there's not a difference between classes you choose, you should a heal, you get a dps classe, you choose a tank, you also get a dps class, you choose a dps class, you get a hard time killing others??????

    dps classes basically attack other dpsers and only attack attack tanks/healers on group like wild hyenas, but no one (except a very few) attack them on 1vs1, why? cause healers and tanks survive way to long and can still kill them, here's the balance, where's the need for dps classes here? not saying that a healer/tank has to die on 1vs1 against dpsers, but if tanks are speced for tanking, they should not kill a dpser as easy as they currently do and vice-versa (on 1vs1 with same gear/level bla bla bla), tanks specked to tank, should require more than one dpser to kill them, sure (same for healers speced on healing), but tanks speced for dps should be well balanced against any dpser on 1vs1, but NO they have heavy armor with the same dps as mages/rogues against their cloth armors (sin and all mages), light (barbarians, that actually feel like cloth armor) or medium (ranger is an exception, stupid noob class currently)

    on a side note about what i just said, ive read on old forums that mages are gonna get revamp, i hope they make them true dpsers against tanks/healers instead of just attack other dpsers and leave tanks/healers alone - the sins are the only classe that i see that work as true dpsers in pvp, they attack and attack hard as it should be, rangers do it also but im not even talk about that specific class, and barbs, well barbs are a bit strange (i survive longer with my barb on pvp, playing in reaver stance with reave/general spec than zerker or hybrid as most pp play, strange, dunno why)

    i feel dps classes are currently the most useless classes in the game (at pve also this happens, just check combat logs and how tanks and some healers can stay on top, dps wise against the dpsers, even when they are tanking/healing mainly) - it looks like in the near future rogues/mages will become tanks/healers and the classes will simple disappear and only unique thing about them will be their name, combos/spells/abilities, off course with the exception that BIG HEALS only come from healers, BIG PUNISHMENTS to tanks but them the dpers, where to they come???

    should the reason to take rogues/mages to a KK run is for the their unique AA abilities!? other dungeons that dont require unique AA, just take a PoM and 5 tanks

    i know mages top parsers in raids (only), not in 6-man (im sure of that cause i do my own combat logs conclusions) and they get top kills in pvp minigames, but thats only cause they attack other mages or rogues, mages 1vs1 with any tank (tanked speced), mage always dead, ridiculous, 1vs1 against healers (specked to heal), mage always dead, ridiculous, 1vs1 against other mages/rogues its more balanced, thats better, may the skill/faster player win or the "counter class" wins...against a tank speced to dps or a healer speced to dps, the results should also be more similar like agaisnt dps classes, may the skill/speed/timing decide who wins

    P.S.: the stances on the soldiers is way to unbalanced, i dont play guard on pvp, only pve, but when im on frenzy with heavey armor, i get almost 30% armor (more than any dpser) and at least 400 base dps, and also i inflict critical hits more often on mobs than i do with my barb, and the barb is way better AA built and better armor, and then i change to defensive stance giving +50% armor and can then return to frenzy stance in less than 3 seconds...so, i can only imagine soldiers in pvp, each 3 seconds having huge dps or huge defense burst, no matter what feats they have - in my opinion a good solution to this would be changing the stas of the stances on the pvp side ONLY, cause on pve things are different and those 3 seconds stance change makes the difference, how hard it is to change that and throw it in test live so pp check if its good or not!???
    Just in case someone missed it, here it is again.

  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ieronon View Post
    Don't know if you're talking about the pre revamp version, or the pre CC-revamp version
    Yeah was talking about the pre-cc revamp version I think, tho I was using it with hofs finisher for group KB, so that's what was left on my mind. Anyway, what shoulda been done is insta cast BoA and KB effect works like Bloodlust.

    And conqs... conqs everywhere. It's the new DT!

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by SlightlyMad View Post
    And conqs... conqs everywhere. It's the new DT!
    very true, dont see DT's anymore, now its only conqs!!!
    why people tend to play easiest i really dont understand, to get the feeling of being strong and the best inside the game maybe!? (never achieved nothing in real life as kids!? )

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by SlightlyMad View Post

    And conqs... conqs everywhere. It's the new DT!
    And yet, even though i'd agree they tend to have imba K/D, they don't get that many kills. Aside from a few good ones and those chasing lowbies or rezpad farming.

    They are bloody annoying because unkillable (i curse the new OtO each time i see it's on ^^) and OP in 1 vs 1 with too much retrebutive damage.
    Vali~The Mental Mushroom
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    Tisane~Kettle of Xotli
    Nvah~ . . .

  10. #20

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    the problem is more about them not dying than killing others (k/d) except on 1vs1

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