UPDATED: How to PVE CONQ

[Shax84]

I would take the Thrice Howled Edge, reasoning with all the +% weapon damage buffs on a Conqueror. A Developer once said that with 1% hate a tank can hold 2,5% as much dps if that dps has 0% hate. 82 hate rating is 2,2% hate, which would hold 5,5% more damage. In my simple math that means if Thrice can do 5,5% more damage than the Riddle, thats a winner. Now, I don't have time to do calculations with all the buffs but just with Lumbering, Mettle and Burning Standard, I think there would be more than 5,5% damage output with the Thrice Howled Edge. Could do calculations later when I get home from work.

[Belsvard]

I don't know, even if its a bit more hate/dps, i would miss those 800 hp and 100 armor

[MisterClean]

Here is the main factor: your gear.

If you are already well geared, reach something like 16 or 17% hate and 56+ % armor, then you don't need the conq sword at all.

I've never had the chance to get the Riddle, so I tank all T4 and T5 up to vistrix with barb sword without any kind of issue. Plus, the more dps, the funnier


However, I would be very happy to see your results Shax. Just to see what's "best in slot" in T4.

[Shax84]

Here is the main factor: your gear.

If you are already well geared, reach something like 16 or 17% hate and 56+ % armor, then you don't need the conq sword at all.

I've never had the chance to get the Riddle, so I tank all T4 and T5 up to vistrix with barb sword without any kind of issue. Plus, the more dps, the funnier


However, I would be very happy to see your results Shax. Just to see what's "best in slot" in T4.

Logged on the conq yesterday to have a look at this but didn't and can't remember exactly now if the standard weapon damage increase is 118% in defensive or neutral. Anyway, if it is 118% in defensive:

5,5% "hate dps" of 144 is 6,9 = 150,9 dps. Already a tight race before we look at the weapon damage increase.

Thrice Howled: 150,5 dps * 118% = 177,59 dps increase = 328,09 dps base weapon damage
Strength and combat rating on Thrice adds 27,5 dps.
Totals: 345,59 dps

Riddle of Steel: 144 dps * 118% = 169,92 dps increase = 313,92 dps base weapon damage
Strength on Riddle of Steel adds 15 dps.
Totals: 328,92 dps

5,5% "hate dps" of 328,92 dps is 18,09 = 347,01 dps

And then we got the Mocking Sneer buff which I have not taken into calculation here, and the group wide weapon damage buffs like Cacodemon and Flanking. But looking above it is 1,5 dps in favour of the Riddle of Steel when doing tank job in terms of pure dps. Increased hit, crit, crit damage ratings will lean more towards Thrice Howled. More strength and the added constitution would lean more towards Riddle of Steel.

And then we could discuss hate. How does it work. Is the 2,2% hate increase from the Riddle of Steel going to improve agro on Retaliation and Irritate? As tested previously in this thread, combos have built in hate levels, like Feint Attack 9 has 2000 worth of built in hate; meaning the extra damage in addition to the opener, steps and combo damage done needed to take agro off the Conqueror. Please look at the linked post below.

http://forums.ageofconan.com/showthr...=1#post2086317

The increased hate on the Riddle of Steel would increase this built in hate from the combo, if I understand that post correctly. The Thrice Howled Edge would do nothing on that built in hate.

All in all, seems like the end results have small differences when it comes to what agro level you can produce. It will be high with both weapons. 100 armor is not exactly make or break on a geared character. Thrice Howled Edge will produce higher crits and more of them. Riddle of Steel looks like having just a wee bit more agro due to the hate rating - on paper. I have neither of the swords on my Conqueror (I have DT, Demo and Sin in T4 so far) so would not be able to give advices beyond this mathematical theoretical experiment.

[Shax84]

On a sidenote, I should say that the calculations in the post above was made with consideration to the weapon alone. The char would of course have much more combat rating and I guess that when determing effects of hate, the dps number on character sheet might be what would be correct to determine added hate from.

To determine for yourself and your gear with your dps number, use this online tool: http://www.onlineconversion.com/percentcalc.htm

[Boesch]

Sorry but that analysis is just with fairy tale numbers and not a single source of any verifiable value.

The conversion of hate to DPS is completely obfuscated and no-one has to my knowledge ever given any kind of figures that will assist us. Comments such as "Feint Attack has built in hate of 2000" is absolutely unhelpful and I would suggest outright false.

Until you can give some sources those numbers are pulled from your ass.

[Caudilloo]

Just a few approximate numbers of built-in hate:

Feint Attack IX. - 2000
Guard of DS IV. - 1500
Batter Aside V. - 1000
HoFS V. - 2000
HoFS VI. - 2300
Whirlwind - 2700(!)
BB VI. - 1200
BB VII. 1400
Bloody Hack VI. - 2300
Bloody Hack V. - 1500
Overwhelm VI. - 1000
Throat Slash - 1000
Irritate - 1000->500 decreased by time
Retaliation - 1500->750 decreased by time

We tested it on different lvl mobs by simply checking how much extra dmg an other player have to deal to get aggro from the conq. The conq and the other player had 0% hate. This extra hate is not added in Frenzy stance ofc.
The equation is something like that: aggro = dps * 3x(probably) hate% + built-in hate

Post #121 in this topic. The part about the hate vs dps is from what some dev claimed on TL forums. I can't find it at the moment.

Thanks for the replies so far guys!

[Boesch]

Post #121 in this topic. The part about the hate vs dps is from what some dev claimed on TL forums. I can't find it at the moment.

Thanks for the replies so far guys!

This has as many credible sources as "don't attack while burn skin is up", ie none

[Shax84]

Sorry but that analysis is just with fairy tale numbers and not a single source of any verifiable value.

The conversion of hate to DPS is completely obfuscated and no-one has to my knowledge ever given any kind of figures that will assist us. Comments such as "Feint Attack has built in hate of 2000" is absolutely unhelpful and I would suggest outright false.

Until you can give some sources those numbers are pulled from your ass.

This has as many credible sources as "don't attack while burn skin is up", ie none

So go ahead and do a test yourself or please f.o. from here with your non helping posts... Fairytale numbers... Try to contribute or shut up with your bigotry.

This is btw my source for the 1% ~ 2,5% argument: http://forums-tl.ageofconan.com/show...744#post574744

[Anzu]

Keep it civil please.